Disposal of Potassium Permanganate?

[Ian]

This question is directed at the INDEPENDENT SCHOOL labbies!

Until recently, my HOD has been happy to abide by CSIS "Appendix D" when needing information about safe disposal of chemicals. Appendix D says to just tip waste KMnO₄ down the sink. No problems! This is what I have done for years and years.

HOWEVER, being an independent school, we are apparently no longer covered by CSIS Appendix D and have to rely on ChemGold MSDS's to be legal. According to ChemGold, KMnO₄ is a Hazardous Waste, and can not be released into the environment or into drains, but must be neutralised by hypochlorate and soda ash and precipitated before being buried in an "authorised land fill" (!!!). This all seems a little excessive for good ol' "Condy's Crystals! What do other independant schools do? Are there any Government schools around Camden NSW who would like my beaker of KMnO₄ solution to tip down their drain? (although I guess I would then have the problem of transporting a hazardous substance, which is also a No No)

The silly thing is that I can buy a bottle of Condy's Crystals from the local Chemist and do what I like with it!

Regards
Ian

[RosalieM]

Interesting point... We are independent and still working under the guidelines of the CSIS. Where did your information come from that we are no longer covered by that? Perhaps we need to change our ways as well...

[Lis]

Hi Ian
We still go by the CSIS too, have you checked the supplier MSDS, what does it say about disposal. ChemGold has generic MSDS is my understanding, although when I went to an inservice at the AIS, they were big on ChemGold MSDS, but I believed it was if there were no manufaturer MSDS's.
Cheers
Lisa

[lada]

Hi Ian,
if you look under pot. permanganate 0.01M, you might be able to dispose down the sink. Just dilute your solution. At that level it is non hazardous.
Lada

[ELIZABETH]

I've heard whispers of this for a while now. I'm in the Catholic systemic system and no-one from our CSO has forwarded any info to me (no real surprise there!). I suspect the changes are maybe due to our changing from state to federal OHS so , since CSIS is state-based (NSW DET) all is changing. I'll wait until someone further up the food chain lets me in on this, although I won't be holding my breath! It just means more confusion here on ChemTalk - too many different systems!

[Ian]

Hi, Me again!
Rosalie, I believe that this is what all the RA debate is about. Gov't schools do not have to do RA's because they are covered by CSIS. We are not covered by CSIS, and so have to do RA's. Because MSDS's only last for 5 years and CSIS is more than 5 years old, it is superseded by the more recent MSDS's in ChemGold, but apparently the Gov't is willing to step in and cover the risk for for DET schools, thus allowing them to continue using the out of date CSIS. (did you get all that?)

Lis, the stuff I have is in a bottle dated 1995!! Someone (before my time) bought about 4 x 500g bottles in 1995 and then ANOTHER 4x 500g bottles in 1996. We use about 1/2 teaspoon full per year, so it will be a while before I order any in to get a fresh MSDS. ChemGold can give me a manufactures MSDS, but I have to fill out some kind of "Registration Form" to get it, so I just settled for the CG2 MSDS.
You are right about the Suppliers MSDS being preferred over the CG2 MSDS, but interestingly, when I last ordered chemicals (last december) and got the Suppliers MSDS's, my HOD told me to throw them out as he preferred the CG2 ones! (go figure!)

Perhaps Lad's solution might be the easiest, just dilute it 'till you can't see it and what you can't see, won't hurt you! Mind you, Lada, even the 0.01M KMnO₄ MSDS talks about burying the residue in Landfill!

regards
Ian

[RosalieM]

Perhaps you can use your large amounts of KMnO4 to make crystals instead of copper sulfate just for something different?

[ELIZABETH]

I think we're a bit off topic here - the real question is not whether we dispose of chemicals following one protocol or another but what are the new rules?

[SGG]

Hi Elizabeth
In NSW, Workcover and OHS Regs state we are to use Manufacturers MSDS. I am in an Independent school, I use Manufacturers MSDS but I also use CSIS with caution(nothing else has yr level info etc).I have recently been able to update my CSIS to DET level (still not necessarily "up-to-date").
Chemwatch is useful but be careful of incorrect info especially in the First Aid area. If in doubt- follow the Manufacturers MSDS.
Regards
Sue G

[Xenon]

Hi Ian. We still use CSIS guidelines.; for disposal of solutions down sink, I go by the Sydney Water limits listed in Appendix E, which is 8g manganese (equivalent 1.5L of 0.1M) per day.

[curie]

Just reading this little thread, hoping someone can clear my confusion. I'm in a catholic school, and am printing out (well trying to) new GHS labels for potassium permanganate solution. The GHS label has a big pictogram of a dead fish and warnings not to release to the environment. The MSDS says to absorb spills with sand to dispose. Yet CSIS says it's OK to pour down the sink .

Can any one clear up which guidlines we abide by?

Thanks

[macca]

Hi, I'm in a catholic school too.

I'd still abide by the CSIS for small diluted amounts eg; Science Focus 1 (Purple convection currents) if it was concentrated or solid I'd go by the GHS MSDS

[Labbie]

I think God is the only one to tell us. No one seems to know.

[Jazz]

this is what I do
KMnO4 Potassium permanganate, KMnO4, is a strong oxidizer,treat the potassium permanganate with a reducing agent, causing the reduction of the Mn ion from the +7 oxidation state to the +2 oxidation state. The Mn+2 can safely be released into the environment.

[macca]

I think God is the only one to tell us. No one seems to know.

did I mentioned where I worked, still don't know

[smiley]

Well...I read that's has an accumulative affect on marine life, and since my drains probably lead directly to the sea (since I'm only one block back AND the school is old) I'm thinking I'll try not to put this down the drain any more! I'm sure the coral will thank me.

[sunray18]

Perhaps all us catholic schools should send an inquiry to our local Bishop's to forward to the Pope for him to ask God for us??
sorry, being cheeky!

[JudyM]

Ian,
I would contact the AIS if I were you. They will know one way or another.
By the way does anyone still do the CSIS training for all school staff?

[AnnNos]

Guilty.

[sunray18]

I thought it was a legal issue - that schools still have to do it every 5 years.