Audit time

[Lis]

Hi All,

I have just been through this thread and found some great info and ideas, but I have a question to those who do the whole school chemical register, how do you find the most efficient way to do this each year, I have just finished ours and it has taken about 2-3 full weeks, I started it last year, and have had to finish it this year. Do you have full MSDS's for ALL things inc liquid paper etc (or minis)or just hazardous chemicals? we were wondering how other schools manage as this is a huge job, and I guess we are looking for the easiest and most efficient way, for the next time. Do you put everything on the register like liquid paper, poster paints, handsoap etc etc etc???
I have set up a spread sheet, but we are at about 10pages, do you combine products or are they listed seperately, as in different brands of whiteboard cleaner, and handsoap for example. My register for science has CAS no, Class, UN no etc, but I found this was imposible for the rest of the school.
Is there an easy way now to try to get teachers to update it each year, or another way to look at it, what do other schools do, if they do any at all, or who is responsible for it. We are having our big inspection this year and we need to have a stategy in place, if anyone has anything, I would greatly appreciate it

cheers
Lisa

[macca]

I do the same each department does there own and hands onto me to process, They get a copy + MSDS back. Print off each department and do whole school total eg. 3 Flammable 22 litres a copy of all registers and totals stay with me and another is kept in the office, for emergencies, along with a school plan marking all chemical storerooms. I pass onto each department colour code stickers and any labels etc., and the chemical incompatability information for storeage. It's up the department head and principal after that to make sure it's done correctly. I use the Chemwatch CD's which are updated 4 times a year, heap better than using it over the internet, it also has the report generator included.

As for liquid paper kids aren't allowed to have at school, poster paints yes, most give off fumes in the case of a fire. Hand soap no, unless it's a special grease remover (TAS). Every Science Practical that goes out has a Mini MSDS attached to the equipment list. I have a portable file with them in it, just check issue date before attaching. Hope this of help to you.

[coxy]

I am surprised - just reading over Bindi's comments from June 2008 and her audit. I have NEVER had an audit (at least, I have never had anyone go through the Science block, that I know of). However, all the complaints about various safety hazards etc., that I have logged with the OH&S Committee here at school have not even been acknowledged. I recently gave a copy of three of them (dated July 2008) to our Principal and asked why nothing had been done, and NOBODY had even spoken to me or checked the problems out. He said he would follow it up. That was week 2 this year! Still nothing. Now the school is in panic mode because an OH&S audit is happening some time in March. We have no: glass bins, first aid kits, emergency showers (except one in my main Prep room, which has no drain, and is directly beside a double powerpoint- one of the problems I listed) and spill kits. The first aid posters have been put in labs, but teachers pin other posters over them. I have never been asked about risk assessments, and not a single teacher within the past 5 years has every even looked at any MSDS that I know of, even though I update them every two years. I was told that because some kids have allergies to bandaids etc., that I am not to give them anything, so I send all students up to the main office where the first aid is handed out. The hand-held showers we put in each lab have been either stolen or broken, so there is nothing, and no-one here seems to worry about it at all. Who is responsible for all this neglect?

[Lyn]

Make the most of this safety audit. It is useful to try and be there when they go through your science labs as you will be able to point out various safety hazards and things you require fixing. They will also make a note of any unsafe practices and situations that you might have overlooked. Storage is paramount ie, no boxes of equipment stored on the floor under benches. If you don't have shelving that can be tricky. For us, shelving which held dry chemicals had to have a lip in place so that chemicals did not fall off the shelf. For liquids in containers/dropper bottles etc, we were supposed to have trays to stop spillage. Up to date chemical register is a big bonus. Current MSDS sheets in place for all your chemicals. They will pick the old chemicals you have and say that they need to be disposed of safely. Your school will have to foot the bill for chemical disposal. Can be expensive. They will look at your chemical storage for flammables, corrosives etc and recommend necessary changes. Now is the time to have your flammables and corrosives exhausted to the exterior of your prep room/s. Equipment that is really old gets turfed, particularly if it hasn't been used since who knows when. Of course your admin is in panic mode because the entire school will be under scrutiny but the outcome will be beneficial to everyone.

[coxy]

Thanks again, Sue, for all that info. I am printing out the reports today, that I have made over the past 12 months - where nothing has eventuated. I hope to hand them to the auditors and I will be staying back late if necessary when they come through Science.

[lizzieb]

Thanks Lyn, for your report on the audit process - I'd like to show that to our OHS committee, and will certainly run it by my HT! That's exactly the list of long term issues we're trying to address now.

[gillegan]

Lyn's info raised another question for me, and that is:
When is a chemical old?
There's stuff in the cupboards here opened in '99 and most other stuff was never dated.
One of the past science teachers told me not to worry, they'll be fine, chemicals don't go off, but I'm wondering.
I'm also wondering about little dropper bottles of mixed chemical solutions. They've been there at least 3 years and I avoid using them as I don't know how old they are or if the person who prepared them knew what they were doing.
Should I dispose of them? And how?

[vlclabbie]

Would some loverly person like to post their lab chemical register for me to peruse please please pretty please....? I'm still trying to get my head around it all & I will soon be the doing it for the whole school (thanks to those who posted their spreadsheets of the other areas - admin/ga)...

Many many thanks...

[matchstick]

Hi Helen
Last term I attended the lab assistants support inservice at which Ric Morante said that MSDS sheets are to be printed on request because the ones in your folders are out of date from the moment they are printed.So if you have folders of MSDS in the staff room you should move them, and liquid paper is not a chemical and theres no need for it to go on your register same with soft drinks.Any probs call Ric,Senoir curiculum Advisor Science ph: 98867679.If you can I advise you to attend the inservice I mentioned above.
Matchstick

[vlclabbie]

THANK YOU RELL!!!!! Thanks for being my loverly person & sending me your chem register! Much Much Kudos to you!!

[matchstick]

Hi agian
Just as an extra note its not the labbies responibility to do the chemregister for "the whole school" that is the resopnibility of the OHS teacher.You only look over the science facaulty chemicals.
Matchstick

[vlclabbie]

Thanks Rell - got your register today! What a fantastic job you've done! Ahhh my life is getting easier... thanks to all of your help!

Apparently I'm going to be the OH&S person for the whole school next year too since I do so much in the lab already for it.... Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr! NOT my fave thing to do but makes sense in a small school!

[macca]

Hi Viclabbie, Sorry I'm with matchstick I don't know what it's like in Vic system. I was the O.H&S rep. (just resigned) plus have done the Chemical Audits for the whole school for eight years. But have always been told there is no such thing as a Chemical Safety in Schools Coordinator (well what the hell have I been doing) . Now I find out through the union I should have been paid at a higher level or partially at a higher level for the time spent. Over eight years thats a lot of money So guess what no more, as of last term I resigned from the non Chemical Safety in Schools Coordinator position Just do Science only. My stress levels have dropped dramatically

[Labbie]

Wow Tori, In the DET schools it is the Head teacher that is the CSIS co-ordinator, as they get paid so much more any way. We labbies can only assistant. How awful for you to have done that job for (Did you say 8 years) and now you learn you could have been paid extra for it. See that is so so wrong, we should have stuff written down, you can do this you can not do that. I am so very sorry to read about all of this Tori. Are you in the PSA, yes I know the PSA, they take for every to get some thing done. But they do get their in the end.

[macca]

Thanks Justsue, but what is PSA never heard of it.

[laurena grieger]

Hi everyone,
I have just been reading all the notes on Audit time and I am dreading the day I get notified. Can I have a copy of your details you used to prepare you for your audit. I am so glad that we have lab technicians that are able to share stories, resources and materials for all to use.

Thanks heaps, and I would appreciate someone emailing me some audit material.

Laurena
Waikerie High
South Australia
email: laurena.grieger@waikeriehs.sa.edu.au

[coxy]

Well, the auditors came to Science, (about 5 minutes before I was due to leave for the day) and I handed them my list of OH&S complaints which I had placed over the past 12 months and to which I had received no response. All they did was ask how I know my stock of chemicals is up to date!!! I showed them my stock list, and how I mark it each time some chemical is finished or disposed of otherwise. That was all they asked. But nothing at all on all the OH&S forms I handed them!! (Re the emergency shower situated beside a double powerpoint, less than 1 metre from chemical cupboards, with polished floor under, no drain, etc., etc., etc.,) Nothing! What a farce!

[lizzieb]

Sue, as you've worked out, the chemical audit is purely about keeping your manifest up to date.

Your OHS concerns should be lodged through proper procedures to your OHS Committee, and then it has to be acted upon.

However, even as a committee member, it took 3 years (and a water leak in chemstore) for my concerns here to be addressed.
Finally, late last year, my Chemstore was inspected by Properties, and no suprises at the result. I was assured it didn't pass, and would be placed on the list for an upgrade, but they couldn't give me a timeframe.
I then pushed for a couple of chemical storage cupboards, as we have none, and room could easily be made for them, which would relieve some of the problems. Haven't heard anything since, and keep getting told not to hold my breath - but at the time just having the situation acknowledged by the Dept. felt like a huge step forward.

Keep lodging your concerns, Sue. Sooner or later they'll have to do something, even if just to keep you quiet!

Have you read through all the relevant posts on Chemtalk - it's come up a few times, and maybe someone else has offered some useful ideas.

[macca]

Hi Viclabbie, Sorry I'm with matchstick I don't know what it's like in Vic system. I was the O.H&S rep. (just resigned) plus have done the Chemical Audits for the whole school for eight years. But have always been told there is no such thing as a Chemical Safety in Schools Coordinator (well what the hell have I been doing) . Now I find out through the union I should have been paid at a higher level or partially at a higher level for the time spent. Over eight years thats a lot of money So guess what no more, as of last term I resigned from the non Chemical Safety in Schools Coordinator position Just do Science only. My stress levels have dropped dramatically

Well I've been asked to reconsider as nobody will do it!!!!!!!!!!!! I stated if I got full cooperation from all departments and higher up the food chain. Plus was paid at a higher level.
I have spoken to the union and they said I shouldn't do it unless the above is in some form of writing, the rep. has asked to post this, to see if any one has any form of documentation regarding a Lab Assistant doing the CSIS Coordinators position. As there is no point in re-inventing the wheel.

So if anyone out there could help that would be great.

I think I'm a fool, but if they come through I'll give it 12 months, if I don't get the backing well I'll resign again.



Thanks Tori

[Labbie]

CSIS states in Vol 1 Workplace training module, Facilitators Notes page 1.

Role of the facilitator

The role of the facilitator will vary according to the nature of the school.

In Primary----------------

Training for staff in science, technological & Applied Studiesw (TAS) and Visual arts involves faculty planning and decision making. It SHOULD be facilitated by the relelvant Head teacher.
End of quote

The reason it should be a head teacher is because they have to teach the other members of staff. And they would not lissen to a Lab Assistant. The facilitator becomes the CSIS Co-ordinator, for the whole school. In most cases it is the Head teacher of science.